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To PP or not to PP - that is the question!

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    To PP or not to PP - that is the question!

    Some thoughts about the recent photo challenge.

    I think one always has to do some PP in order to bring the best out in the photo. Maybe lighten an area, darken etc.
    I used to print photos in a photo lab, (here of course I could only alter the colour balance and contrast) and people would come in with their 35mm film and would want an hour develop and print. (D&P) Of course this would go through the printer and if the film was exposed correctly the film would go through the machine and prints would come out the other end mostly fine. (It depended on the photographer).

    The situation would get a bit tricky if the film was water damaged, X-ray damaged, light damaged, over exposed, under exposed ... the customer would still want a great print!

    Also I would print for some wedding photographers, newspaper photographers... and they can be picky about colour, skin colour and you know who you are! This is where printing knowledge would come in and knowing about colour theory! If a printer did not understand this, then he/she would not know what colour filters (CMY) to add or subtract in order to get correct skin tones, etc ,etc... (The machine would sometimes compensate the colour balance incorrectly).

    The point here is at least something has to be done during the printing stage; it is the same with PP –as what has already been mentioned! To bring out the best in a photo it needs to be done. An image can still win though with minimal PP. Because it is more about the image than the skill in PP (at least in regard to the photo challenge, I think!). That brings me to my next point.

    COMPOSITION

    This was raised by a poster who wanted to improve his composition. I feel that many people take shots of nothing. Having a digital camera allows us to shoot a whole card of nothing - no cost incurred. It was different with film! I myself have been interested in photography for years, but had not the money or the equipment to develop my skills. Now with digital and a computer, I can experiment a lot more and try to ‘see’. (Don’t think I have been very successful to date though). I don’t think many people have ‘learnt to see’. With or without PP, an image is NOTHING without THOUGHT in my view. With PP, an image can be emphasised a little or a lot more, but the essence SHOULD already be there.

    With regard to adding/subtracting elements from a photo, altering focal length, focusing on part rather than the whole may reveal something more than a shot of the whole! If that can’t be done then perhaps cloning out an element in photoshop or just mere cropping. Great skill is not required here, but great skill is required in ‘SEEING’.
    Richard

    Think before you press the shutter button!

    #2
    Re: To PP or not to PP - that is the question!

    As your strapline says Richard: Wise Words.

    On the subject of Ansel Adams, I went to an exhibition of his work many years ago and of all of his prints exhibited, there was a before and after version of one shot. A straight print from the neg and a worked on print. The first was very good, because everything was right with the subject and the composition, the second was WOW, because of his expertise as a printer, able to pull the very best out of the neg.

    Colin
    Colin

    Comment


      #3
      Re: To PP or not to PP - that is the question!

      The real answer to this is to leave it to the personal choice of the photographer. He/she is in control of this process. I really can't see the point in fellow members getting emotive about this.It is quite possible, given time, most photographers will move towards PP. However the choice must be there for people to decide.
      Canon 6D; Canon 760D;Canon G15;Canon 40mm f2.8(Pancake);Canon 50mm f1.8(ii); Canon 17mm-40mm f4L;Canon EF-S 10-18mm f4.5-5.6 IS STM;Canon EF-S 55-250mm f4-5.6 STM lens;Canon 24mm-105mmf4L IS;Canon 70-300mm f4-f5.6 L IS USM;Kenko 1.4x HD TC;Canon 430EX ii flash;Giottos tripod;Manfretto monopod;Cokin P filters + bits and pieces!

      www.flickr.com/photos/nathaniel3390

      North Wales where music and the sea give a great concert!

      Comment


        #4
        Re: To PP or not to PP - that is the question!

        I’m just gonna buy a camera with drab, ill composed picture detection built in.

        Comes with customisable audio warnings either John McEnroe shoutiing, "you cannot be serious" !
        Or Clint Eastwood's dirty harry saying " don't even think about it !

        Millie

        Comment


          #5
          Re: To PP or not to PP - that is the question!

          Originally posted by Nathaniel Ramanaden View Post
          The real answer to this is to leave it to the personal choice of the photographer. He/she is in control of this process. I really can't see the point in fellow members getting emotive about this.It is quite possible, given time, most photographers will move towards PP. However the choice must be there for people to decide.
          Nathaniel
          I think what we are saying is that your images will never have the extra edge or dimension they could have wityh a little PP. You may not want to do for a variety of reasons , but that doesn't mean it's not needed. Like you say a very personal choice.

          Jim
          Last edited by EOS_Jim; 11-06-2010, 20:54.
          5DIII, 5DII with Grips| 24-70 f2.8L MkII | 24-105 f4L IS | 70-200 f2.8L IS MkII | 50 f/1.4 | 85 f1.8 | 100 f2.8 | 1.4x MkII | Tamron 17-35 f2.8-4 | 580EX II | 600EX RT | Stofen Diffuser | Manfroto 190 CF Tripod w/490RC2 | Epson R3000 | Lexmark CS 510 DE | Nova 5 AW | Mini Trekker AW | Lowepro x300AW | Lastolite Gear (inc HiLite 6x7) | Elinchrom Studio Gear & Quadras

          Comment


            #6
            Re: To PP or not to PP - that is the question!

            Originally posted by Millie View Post
            I’m just gonna buy a camera with drab, ill composed picture detection built in.

            Comes with customisable audio warnings either John McEnroe shoutiing, "you cannot be serious" !
            Or Clint Eastwood's dirty harry saying " don't even think about it !

            Millie
            I'll buy 2 if the quality is anything like the 5DII :)
            5DIII, 5DII with Grips| 24-70 f2.8L MkII | 24-105 f4L IS | 70-200 f2.8L IS MkII | 50 f/1.4 | 85 f1.8 | 100 f2.8 | 1.4x MkII | Tamron 17-35 f2.8-4 | 580EX II | 600EX RT | Stofen Diffuser | Manfroto 190 CF Tripod w/490RC2 | Epson R3000 | Lexmark CS 510 DE | Nova 5 AW | Mini Trekker AW | Lowepro x300AW | Lastolite Gear (inc HiLite 6x7) | Elinchrom Studio Gear & Quadras

            Comment


              #7
              Re: To PP or not to PP - that is the question!

              Originally posted by EOS_Jim View Post
              Brian
              I think what we are saying is that your images will never have the extra edge or dimension they could have wityh a little PP. You may not want to do for a variety of reasons , but that doesn't mean it's not needed. Like you say a very personal choice.

              Jim
              You are confusing me with Nathaniel

              I am the one with the beard
              ef-r

              Comment


                #8
                Re: To PP or not to PP - that is the question!

                Good to see you using the smilies again Brian

                Millie

                Comment


                  #9
                  Re: To PP or not to PP - that is the question!

                  I am entitled to be a grumpy old man sometimes
                  Last edited by briansquibb; 11-06-2010, 17:39.
                  ef-r

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Re: To PP or not to PP - that is the question!

                    Originally posted by briansquibb View Post
                    You are confusing me with Nathaniel

                    I am the one with the beard
                    I am the one without the beard, from Cheshire. Brian is the gentleman with the beard, from Kent.
                    Canon 6D; Canon 760D;Canon G15;Canon 40mm f2.8(Pancake);Canon 50mm f1.8(ii); Canon 17mm-40mm f4L;Canon EF-S 10-18mm f4.5-5.6 IS STM;Canon EF-S 55-250mm f4-5.6 STM lens;Canon 24mm-105mmf4L IS;Canon 70-300mm f4-f5.6 L IS USM;Kenko 1.4x HD TC;Canon 430EX ii flash;Giottos tripod;Manfretto monopod;Cokin P filters + bits and pieces!

                    www.flickr.com/photos/nathaniel3390

                    North Wales where music and the sea give a great concert!

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Re: To PP or not to PP - that is the question!

                      Originally posted by colin C View Post
                      As your strapline says Richard: Wise Words.

                      On the subject of Ansel Adams, I went to an exhibition of his work many years ago and of all of his prints exhibited, there was a before and after version of one shot. A straight print from the neg and a worked on print. The first was very good, because everything was right with the subject and the composition, the second was WOW, because of his expertise as a printer, able to pull the very best out of the neg.

                      Colin
                      I am sure you are right otherwise 99% of the members will not be "up in arms" on this subject. There is of course the other 1%, like me who are between two stools! At the moment I don't wish to spend time with PP. I also have got other demands on my time at the moment- i.e my other interests+ family.
                      Canon 6D; Canon 760D;Canon G15;Canon 40mm f2.8(Pancake);Canon 50mm f1.8(ii); Canon 17mm-40mm f4L;Canon EF-S 10-18mm f4.5-5.6 IS STM;Canon EF-S 55-250mm f4-5.6 STM lens;Canon 24mm-105mmf4L IS;Canon 70-300mm f4-f5.6 L IS USM;Kenko 1.4x HD TC;Canon 430EX ii flash;Giottos tripod;Manfretto monopod;Cokin P filters + bits and pieces!

                      www.flickr.com/photos/nathaniel3390

                      North Wales where music and the sea give a great concert!

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Re: To PP or not to PP - that is the question!

                        Originally posted by briansquibb View Post
                        You are confusing me with Nathaniel

                        I am the one with the beard
                        I think Brian you should post your Avator, with the beard etc so that there is no mistaking who you are!!
                        Canon 6D; Canon 760D;Canon G15;Canon 40mm f2.8(Pancake);Canon 50mm f1.8(ii); Canon 17mm-40mm f4L;Canon EF-S 10-18mm f4.5-5.6 IS STM;Canon EF-S 55-250mm f4-5.6 STM lens;Canon 24mm-105mmf4L IS;Canon 70-300mm f4-f5.6 L IS USM;Kenko 1.4x HD TC;Canon 430EX ii flash;Giottos tripod;Manfretto monopod;Cokin P filters + bits and pieces!

                        www.flickr.com/photos/nathaniel3390

                        North Wales where music and the sea give a great concert!

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Re: To PP or not to PP - that is the question!

                          I'm the one with the beard and so shy I dont have a avatar
                          ef-r

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Re: To PP or not to PP - that is the question!

                            Good question. I'm on the side of 'take the right picture, minor adjustments are OK'

                            So, as you would have done with film (I chose my processor company carefully), but can now do myself, I will now change saturation - including B&W without the need for changing film, white balance and contrast. A couple of other fixes that you can't do in camera such as minor exposure changes or B&W filrers, and some cropping. Cloning, healing (other than for defects such as dust), changing wholesale items (importing skies that weren't there) are a no-no. I'm happy to enhance what I've got, but I have no truck for making it into something I didn't get. Adding or removing features I associate with communist Russia!
                            Canon EOS7D mkII+BG-E16, Canon EOS 7D+BG-E7, Canon EF-S 10-22 f/3.5-4.5, Tamron Di-II 17-50 f2.8, Canon EF 24-105 f/4L IS, Canon EF 70-200 f/4L, Sigma 30mm f1.4 DC HSM 'Art', Canon EF 50mm f/1.4 USM, Sigma 1.4x DG, Canon Speedlight 430EX II (x2)

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Re: To PP or not to PP - that is the question!

                              Originally posted by briansquibb View Post
                              You are confusing me with Nathaniel

                              I am the one with the beard
                              Sorry Brian :) I too have a beard :) (goatee)
                              5DIII, 5DII with Grips| 24-70 f2.8L MkII | 24-105 f4L IS | 70-200 f2.8L IS MkII | 50 f/1.4 | 85 f1.8 | 100 f2.8 | 1.4x MkII | Tamron 17-35 f2.8-4 | 580EX II | 600EX RT | Stofen Diffuser | Manfroto 190 CF Tripod w/490RC2 | Epson R3000 | Lexmark CS 510 DE | Nova 5 AW | Mini Trekker AW | Lowepro x300AW | Lastolite Gear (inc HiLite 6x7) | Elinchrom Studio Gear & Quadras

                              Comment

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