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    AA filter

    Is it time for Canon to scrap the AA filter (also known as a low past filter)on their new DLSR models.
    The guy i work for has just sold his Canon 1D +70-200 and replaced with the Nikon D500 +70-200.

    The sharpness of his first set of Images (from the radio 1 big weekend)was jaw dropping with only very basic PP done in LR(cropped /straightened/sharpened/ resized so basically straight from camera.

    The reason i think they were so sharp is because the D500 has the AA filter removed (not because Nikon is better than Canon and all that nonsense) so is it time for Canon to also removes this filter? does the pros out way the cons.

    Paul
    EOS 1Dx, - EF 24-105L f4,- Sigma 135 f1.8 Art - EF 400L IS f2.8, - Speedlite 430EXII.
    Freelance Sports Photographer for local Press - https://twitter.com/P_linton99

    #2
    Re: AA filter

    Neither of the Fuji cameras I use (X-E1 and X-Pro 2) have an AA filter and I don't miss it in the slightest so I would say yes.
    EOS 7D mk II, Sigma 150-660C, Canon 17-85 EF-S, Tamron 10-24 and a wife who shares my obsession.

    Comment


      #3
      Re: AA filter

      If you read some of the 5DS(r) material you get some background on the needs / benefits or otherwise regarding AA. Interestingly, the 5DSr seems to actually have AA but with the addition of a reversing element as opposed to not having any AA in the path. Personally I don't quite understand the logic in that but it might have been a commercial design decision. I thought long and hard before deciding but eventually went with the 5DSr and have not experienced any moire problems.

      Comment


        #4
        Re: AA filter

        Originally posted by AndyMulhearn View Post
        Neither of the Fuji cameras I use (X-E1 and X-Pro 2) have an AA filter and I don't miss it in the slightest so I would say yes.
        Seems a very popular decision in the mirror less Cameras world, I Would love to see the 7D MK III with this filter removed.

        Originally posted by Enigma View Post
        If you read some of the 5DS(r) material you get some background on the needs / benefits or otherwise regarding AA. Interestingly, the 5DSr seems to actually have AA but with the addition of a reversing element as opposed to not having any AA in the path. Personally I don't quite understand the logic in that but it might have been a commercial design decision. I thought long and hard before deciding but eventually went with the 5DSr and have not experienced any moire problems.
        Think i could live with Moire for the added benefit of sharpness.

        Paul
        EOS 1Dx, - EF 24-105L f4,- Sigma 135 f1.8 Art - EF 400L IS f2.8, - Speedlite 430EXII.
        Freelance Sports Photographer for local Press - https://twitter.com/P_linton99

        Comment


          #5
          Re: AA filter

          I have recently spent a couple of weeks on Mull and got into an interesting discussion with a photographer from the "Dark Side". I don't care ........ talk to anyone, me! I don't keep up with any offerings from other manufacturers, but being a Canon man I obviously don't need to.

          So, during our discussion he mentioned that his camera didn't have an AA filter. That was obviously rubbish, but not wishing to be confrontational, I mentioned are you sure? He was quite sure, so I was happy to leave him in his ignorance. But I quietly grabbed my laptop and looked his camera specs up on "Tinternet". Showing him the error of his ways in writing would surely settle the matter in my favour.

          I then said: "John ........ having checked the specs, you are correct and I am wrong. I bow to your greater knowledge and apologise for my error.
          Colin

          Comment


            #6
            Re: AA filter

            But do images have a natural look.....Canon images do look real world, some of the CSC images don't look as natural having used Olympus OMD, Pen, Fuji XT1, XPro1....just my opinion.
            Brian Vickers LRPS

            brianvickersphotography.com

            Comment


              #7
              Re: AA filter

              Some of the latest Nikon gear is good really good BUT there is also a lot of problems with some of it ,you only hear whispers and a lot of it is suppressed but knowing quite a few friends that use Nikon gear I am quite happy to stay with canon .my own experiences with the brand made me change back to canon a few years ago it's no good having gear that lets you down at the crucial moment just because it has some bells and whistles that might or might not be useful

              Comment


                #8
                Re: AA filter

                I'm not trying to suggest Nikon is the way to go has i love my Canon and have no interest in jumping ship, but seeing the benefits for not having a low pass filter opened my eyes a little and now wonder why we still need this filter.

                Makes me think all my lenses could actually perform as intended and not lose some of there potential due to this filter.

                Paul
                EOS 1Dx, - EF 24-105L f4,- Sigma 135 f1.8 Art - EF 400L IS f2.8, - Speedlite 430EXII.
                Freelance Sports Photographer for local Press - https://twitter.com/P_linton99

                Comment


                  #9
                  Re: AA filter

                  I'm sure I read somewhere that you can remove it from the sensor yourself?
                  If you're feeling brave.....
                  Brian Vickers LRPS

                  brianvickersphotography.com

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Re: AA filter

                    Originally posted by brianvickers View Post
                    I'm sure I read somewhere that you can remove it from the sensor yourself?
                    If you're feeling brave.....
                    LOL no I'm not that brave.

                    Paul
                    EOS 1Dx, - EF 24-105L f4,- Sigma 135 f1.8 Art - EF 400L IS f2.8, - Speedlite 430EXII.
                    Freelance Sports Photographer for local Press - https://twitter.com/P_linton99

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Re: AA filter

                      Originally posted by brianvickers View Post
                      I'm sure I read somewhere that you can remove it from the sensor yourself?
                      If you're feeling brave.....
                      A small hammer and chisel and a piece of emery paper springs to mind.
                      EOS 7D mk II, Sigma 150-660C, Canon 17-85 EF-S, Tamron 10-24 and a wife who shares my obsession.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Re: AA filter

                        Originally posted by AndyMulhearn View Post
                        A small hammer and chisel and a piece of emery paper springs to mind.
                        A trip to Canon repair centre springs to my mind if attempted such a thing

                        Paul
                        EOS 1Dx, - EF 24-105L f4,- Sigma 135 f1.8 Art - EF 400L IS f2.8, - Speedlite 430EXII.
                        Freelance Sports Photographer for local Press - https://twitter.com/P_linton99

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Re: AA filter

                          I was jesting

                          There are services that will do stuff with sensors, for example: https://www.lifepixel.com/shop/our-s...filter-removal

                          Not a recommendation as I've never done anything like this, just bought a Fuji without one in the first place.
                          EOS 7D mk II, Sigma 150-660C, Canon 17-85 EF-S, Tamron 10-24 and a wife who shares my obsession.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Re: AA filter

                            Originally posted by paul linton View Post
                            I'm not trying to suggest Nikon is the way to go has i love my Canon and have no interest in jumping ship, but seeing the benefits for not having a low pass filter opened my eyes a little and now wonder why we still need this filter.

                            Paul
                            In most instances and with modern high density sensors - 24/36Mp on APS/fullframe - it probably isn't. As said several Nikon models lack one along with certain mirrorless models including, IIRC, some of the full frame Sonys yet there don't exactly seem to be any significant problems with these cameras - the internet'd full of it otherwise.

                            The AA filter originally had it's purpose when pixel counts were low and curved or angles lines were prone to jaggies or natural patterns were more likely to almost coincide with the pixel pattern and cause moire effects. By slightly blurring the image the patterns are disrupted and jaggies are smoothed out. Today's pixel counts are easily high enough to give smooth curves and angles lines and are probably so fine that few natural patterns are fine or regular enough to cause optical interference.

                            FWIW and as Nikon user (as well) my suspicion is that Nikon have always had less aggressive AA filters than Canon - while I can offer no definitive proof images out of my D50 and D5000 have always looked 'sharper' at pixel level than my nearest Canon equivalents (20D and 40D respectively). On the downside the D50 at least does showa tendency for curved and angled lines to exhibit a clear, jagged, stair step character - though I can't recall ever seeing any noticeable moire effects. I guess it's a case of swings and roundabouts.

                            Sooner or later Canon will likely drop the AA filter where it's practicable.
                            Nigel

                            You may know me from Another Place....

                            The new ElSid Photogallery...

                            Equipment: Far too much to list - including lots of Nikon...

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Re: AA filter

                              Originally posted by AndyMulhearn View Post
                              I was jesting

                              There are services that will do stuff with sensors, for example: https://www.lifepixel.com/shop/our-s...filter-removal

                              Not a recommendation as I've never done anything like this, just bought a Fuji without one in the first place.
                              Thanks for the link Andy but I don't want to alter my Camera, I just hope Canon gives us a choice!

                              Paul
                              EOS 1Dx, - EF 24-105L f4,- Sigma 135 f1.8 Art - EF 400L IS f2.8, - Speedlite 430EXII.
                              Freelance Sports Photographer for local Press - https://twitter.com/P_linton99

                              Comment

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