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Mulling things over

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    #31
    Re: Mulling things over

    a FF CSC would need the same back of lens to sensor distance as you have now on EF full frame lens/cameras.
    It doesn't sound like that would be particularly difficult to do. I assume a FF CSC would be bigger than the M series anyway. I think people would be willing to sacrifice a little in extra size in order to be able to use their existing lenses seamlessly. Canon's biggest strength is the enormous range of lenses available, both its own make and those from third party manufacturers.
    EOS 6D, 6D Mk II, 80D, 70D, 100D, 200D, M50, M100. Canon 10-18, 18 - 55, 55 - 250 IS STM lenses, Canon 16 - 35 mm F4L, 35 mm EF-S macro, 50 mm F1.8 STM, 60 mm EF-S macro, MPE-65 macro, 85 mm F1.8, 200 mm F2.8 L II, M 15 - 45 mm, M 22mm F2, M 32mm F1.4. Sigma 24 - 35 F2 Art, 135 mm F1.8 Art, 17 - 50 F2.8 DC, 105 mm OS macro, 100 - 400 C, 150 - 600 C.

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      #32
      Re: Mulling things over

      Originally posted by Richard W View Post
      But not yet full frame, essential for pro use these days.
      Compared to what Nikon (and Pentax) have, it's viable because it actually exists. Unless you count their Nikon 1 offering which has died. Fuji (my mirrorless brand of choice) are doing very well on mainly APS-C but with one MF offering. They need longer lens options though, something from the Tamron/Sigma stable would help...

      Adapters have been a weak spot for mirrorless, many reports that lenses don't focus nearly as well with them. Also, they are quite big which rather negates the point of having a very small camera.
      Agree completely. Native lenses please, and many of them. Adaptors are not really what people buy these cameras to use. Yes, it's nice to be able to try your current lenses, in the case of Canon, but really to get the most out of a small system you want small lenses to go with it. For an example, the f2 WR lens range Fuji has. Very nice, small, weather resistant and high quality. That sort of thing.

      Yes, the lens system for the M series is very limited and tests seem consistently to show that they are not as good as the basic equivalents on slrs, e.g. the 55 - 200 for M has far worse performance than the 55 - 250 IS STM. And all lenses on the M series show very high levels of vignetting, opinion seems to be that the body design struggles to cope with the APS-C size sensor. I did consider one of the M series when I got the 200d but the disadvantages seemed to outweigh the benefits.
      It doesn't have to be that way. Sometimes these manufacturers make it like pulling teeth...
      EOS 7D mk II, Sigma 150-660C, Canon 17-85 EF-S, Tamron 10-24 and a wife who shares my obsession.

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        #33
        Re: Mulling things over

        I will hopefully be trying out a 55-250 stm tomorrow if I like it I will get one .but to be honest I'm not totally sure on the M series yet ,probably because theres not much to go at macro wise yet .the only thing in its favour so far is the price was right

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          #34
          Re: Mulling things over

          I will hopefully be trying out a 55-250 stm
          Do you mean the EF-S 55 - 250 or the EF-M 55-200mm? If it's the second, I'd advise you to read this :

          not exactly complementary.

          I've not found the EF-S 55 - 250 IS STM very good for moving targets, tends to hunt a lot on the 80d, good for things that are sitting still.
          EOS 6D, 6D Mk II, 80D, 70D, 100D, 200D, M50, M100. Canon 10-18, 18 - 55, 55 - 250 IS STM lenses, Canon 16 - 35 mm F4L, 35 mm EF-S macro, 50 mm F1.8 STM, 60 mm EF-S macro, MPE-65 macro, 85 mm F1.8, 200 mm F2.8 L II, M 15 - 45 mm, M 22mm F2, M 32mm F1.4. Sigma 24 - 35 F2 Art, 135 mm F1.8 Art, 17 - 50 F2.8 DC, 105 mm OS macro, 100 - 400 C, 150 - 600 C.

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            #35
            Re: Mulling things over

            Compared to what Nikon (and Pentax) have, it's viable because it actually exists.
            For professionals, the only brand that matters in CSC is Sony, many pros are abandoning Canon and Nikon for the A series. Sony are well ahead of everybody else in sensor technology, even Canon compact cameras with 1 inch sensors have Sony backlit sensors now.
            EOS 6D, 6D Mk II, 80D, 70D, 100D, 200D, M50, M100. Canon 10-18, 18 - 55, 55 - 250 IS STM lenses, Canon 16 - 35 mm F4L, 35 mm EF-S macro, 50 mm F1.8 STM, 60 mm EF-S macro, MPE-65 macro, 85 mm F1.8, 200 mm F2.8 L II, M 15 - 45 mm, M 22mm F2, M 32mm F1.4. Sigma 24 - 35 F2 Art, 135 mm F1.8 Art, 17 - 50 F2.8 DC, 105 mm OS macro, 100 - 400 C, 150 - 600 C.

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              #36
              Re: Mulling things over

              I have the EF-S 55-250STM...and it produces very good results....but a bit slow to focus and doesn't like moving targets on my 200D


              also Sony made the sensors for Olympus OM-D E-M5 and variants
              Brian Vickers LRPS

              brianvickersphotography.com

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                #37
                Re: Mulling things over

                Originally posted by Richard W View Post
                What I mean is a mount that means all existing EF lenses designed for dslrs can also fit a full frame mirrorless body without needing an adapter, in effect a mirrorless camera with the same EF mount as we have on our slrs. Not sure if that is the same as you are saying. I've just read that it could be difficult.
                A mirrorless FF EOS camera than can take standard EF lenses? Could be simply done by means of removing the mirror from a standard FF DSLR and substituting the pentaprism and optical finder with an electronic one. That way the correct lens registration could be retained easily, of course it would't really be any smaller than a normal DSLR though I imagine the body could be shrunk a bit.

                What I suspect you mean is something akin is shape and size to the Sony A9/A7 bodies. Problem is the EF lens mount registration is 44mm compared to the 18mm that Sony's E-mount uses. To get an EF mount lens to focus at such a reduced registration would require some form of optical correction lens(es) similar to that used in the now rare FD/EF adapter available in the early days of EOS. Whether this could be mounted inside the camera mount and designed in such a way as to not interfere with the rear of the typical EF lens is the issue. Personally I suspect that even if it could be done it may prove to be expensive to implement, something of a compromise in order to cover the whole EF lens range where ultra wide angles have different characteristics to telephotos etc and may still need a longish registration distance to fit it all in. A straight mount adapter with no optical components is almost as simple as the first option...

                One thing to remember about the Sony FF mirrorless models is that while the cameras a a little smaller than a typical SLR the lenses aren't. A few months ago we had a Sony evening at club and our local LCE arranged for Sony to bring along a full range of bodies and lenses and believe me a Sony E-mount 24-70 f2.8 is no smaller than it's Canon equivalent and that same went for the other lenses as well. Actually mounted on an Alpha body they weren't always as well balanced in the hand either due to the smaller body size.

                I guess Sony never had that problem as they never made slrs.

                Sorry but they did... Sony bought much of their still camera business from Konica-Minolta who manufactured both compact and bridge cameras and a couple of early DSLRs. Sony then developed these on into the first Alpha cameras, such as the A350, before introducing the mirrorless APS format NEX series from which the FF version developed. When they bought the K-M business they inherited the Minolta A-mount system which continues to this day in the Sony A99, A77 and A68 models although technically these aren't SLRs as they use a fixed partial mirror to reflect some of the light upwards to a second sensor which powers an electronic finder; effectively they are a sort of hybrid.

                When Sony developed the FF mirrorless range I suspect they felt it made more sense to utilise the existing E-mount from the NEX models and develop new lenses to fit the FF cameras - plus of course these would also fit existing APS format NEX/Alpha models. My own feeling is that Sony will simply allow the A-mount cameras to die a natural death in the near future and concentrate on the mirrorless models.
                Last edited by El Sid; 08-03-2018, 13:38.
                Nigel

                You may know me from Another Place....

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