Ring-Flash bounce back

[Dave_S]

Has anyone come up with an effective method of dealing flash bounce back (for want of a better word ), when using a ring-flash for macro work.

My setup: 5D3 + Sigma 105mm f/2.8 EX Macro + Nissin MF18 Ring-Flash.

Macro without the flash, and in good ambient light, no problem, and excellent results, if the subject will sit still for long enough that is.

Once I introduce the Ring-Flash, then any reflective surface on the creature, bounces the flash back to the lens, causing white (blown out) specs or areas on the image of the subject.

I have seen this in many macro images, so its not just me.

A bad example recently, was a shot that took of a frog in the garden, whose skin was wet and glistening, and the flash bounce back, pretty much turned what would have been a reasonable shot, into a crap one.

Dave

[Dave_S]

Re: Ring-Flash bounce back

Ok, it would seem that either nobody here is using a macro ring-flash, or if they are, they are having the 'bounce problem' as me, and like me, not able to offer a solution.

So, let's try another thought. . Does anyone here us an LED ring-light for macro, and if so, do you find that with its intensity (possibly adjustable) being less harsh than that of a flash tube, that it provides a softer light, that doesn't give burned out highlight areas on insects shiny surfaces?

Dave

[ST-EOS]

Re: Ring-Flash bounce back

Dave it isn't just with a ring flash that you will see the "flash bounce back" it can be a problem with a lot of macro flash images with shiny objects do show hot spots from the flash. Most macro togs will employ some sort of diffuser in front of the flash using either a softbox (on a normal flash) or kitchen paper, soft plastic wrapping foam etc. Have a look HERE for some ideas.

[Dave_S]

Re: Ring-Flash bounce back

The Nissin MF18 does have an opaque diffuser over the flash tubes Peter, but its clearly not enough, even when I back-off the flash intensity.

I guess it make the whole idea of a macro ring-flash, a bit of a nonsense really, as 'bounce back' is pretty much unavoidable at macro distances.

However, I will try increasing the diffusion on the front of the ring-flash with, as you suggest, paper kitchen roll or similar.

I could of course try avoiding shiny creatures.

Dave

[Tigger]

Re: Ring-Flash bounce back

Has anyone come up with an effective method of dealing flash bounce back (for want of a better word ), when using a ring-flash for macro work.

My setup: 5D3 + Sigma 105mm f/2.8 EX Macro + Nissin MF18 Ring-Flash.

Macro without the flash, and in good ambient light, no problem, and excellent results, if the subject will sit still for long enough that is.

Once I introduce the Ring-Flash, then any reflective surface on the creature, bounces the flash back to the lens, causing white (blown out) specs or areas on the image of the subject.

I have seen this in many macro images, so its not just me.

A bad example recently, was a shot that took of a frog in the garden, whose skin was wet and glistening, and the flash bounce back, pretty much turned what would have been a reasonable shot, into a crap one.

Dave

Yes Dave I've had this problem and with the same set up as you ... In most cases I've just edited in PP and lost it, although in some cases I've pulled the output down then re adjusted in PP if required ...

I'm surprised you were able to get that close to a frog to use a RF & macro - I've got a pond and have only every managed frog photos using my 70-200 with a 1.4

I guess it make the whole idea of a macro ring-flash, a bit of a nonsense really, as 'bounce back' is pretty much unavoidable at macro distances.

Dave

do you have examples of this Dave ? I've been pleased with the results I've had from this RF

[Dave_S]

Re: Ring-Flash bounce back

[QUOTE=Tigger;230245]do you have examples of this Dave ?[/QUOTE

I do, but at the moment I'm having trouble in uploading them to this 'board'.

I usually post images from Flick, but these images are not on Flickr, so I tried a direct upload.

I'll try again later.

Dave

[Tigger]

Re: Ring-Flash bounce back

OK - look forward to seeing it as it sounds like you did a lot of work to get the image right

[Dave_S]

Re: Ring-Flash bounce back

do you have examples of this Dave ?

Here's the Frog as shot with the ring-flash, and then after painstakingly removing the blown out white specs in P/shop at almost pixel level, which was a VERY time consuming process.

It was shot from about 1 metre distance, as I didn't want to spook him, and then cropped. When I tried to get a second shot closer in, he hopped into the bushes.

I have zoomed right in on the original image, and cropped again, to make it easier to see the burned out points.

Dave

[Tigger]

Re: Ring-Flash bounce back

I see what you mean about bounce back now - I suppose any flash will struggle if your pointing it directly towards a wet shinny surface and they don't get much worse than a frog .. although if at one meter why did you use a RF?

[Dave_S]

Re: Ring-Flash bounce back

He was in a very heavily shaded area of the Patio, so not enough light to go without the flash, while hand-held.

Maybe I'll catch him another day when he is in better light.

I had the same reflection problem off the wings of a Bluebottle.

Not an uncommon problem, as I see it in other peoples macros.

For the sake of around £30, I might try and LED ring light, to see if that is any better.

Dave

[Tigger]

Re: Ring-Flash bounce back

At one meter I would have tried a flash with a diffuser rather than a RF -

A friend bought one of those LED lights and the results were really poor as they lack any power and you mite as well just try hand holding at slower speeds - I know its only £30 (his words as well) but he wasted it

[Dave_S]

Re: Ring-Flash bounce back

I have a Multi LED lamp with diffuser that I use with my table-top macro setup, and that works very well indeed, albeit I haven't used it on a wet Frog.

Not shown in the picture of the setup, but I bought a tiltable adapter, which raise the raises the lamp above the camera, and enables me to tilt the lamp down towards the subject, thus avoiding any shadow from the lens barrel.

Dave

[Tigger]

Re: Ring-Flash bounce back

maybe the ones with more lights in the unit work better as my friend bought the Ring LED and he certainly wasn't impressed - I'll be interested to hear your views should you buy one

[Dave_S]

Re: Ring-Flash bounce back

Or maybe something like this, where the flash is angled from each side, but at £749, I think I'll give that one a miss.

Dave

[Tigger]

Re: Ring-Flash bounce back

yeah I remember looking at that when I was researching RF - I choose the Nissin, cost had nothing to do with it